Response to Neil on his ‘Free From Law or Free From Sin. Part 3’ comment.

10 Apr

Hi Neil,

Thank you for giving me the opportunity to answer your questions.  Your words are in bold and I will answer as best I can.

I have always seen that ‘law’ has different meanings in the new testament,

This is very true, and an accurate statement.  As I have said before, the word for ‘law’ in the NT is ALWAYS ‘nomos’ as there is no other Greek word for ‘law’.  This word is used for many different contexts, including, the laws of man, the laws of YHVH and even customs that become law through use over a long period of time.

and that the Law (Plan of God for our lives) is not the same as the ‘law’ of sin and death.

This is the whole point of what I said above.  The only way that we can know which ‘nomos’ is being talked about is by the context.  Unfortunately sometimes it is a little obscure.  It is also unfortunate that the majority of translations that are available to us are translated by people that have a predisposed bias to us not being ‘under Jewish law’.  It is then this biased view, unconsciously, that is used to decide what this word is talking about.  Invariably when the average Christian and theologian reads it, the first thought is the ‘Jewish laws’.  But let me ask you a serious question and I would like you to try to put your bias aside when thinking about this (we all have a bias, so I am not being insulting).  The question is this:  Does YHVH ever change?  And if He does not change, does it make sense that He would give a law, like the Sabbath, and say it is to be observed as an everlasting sign and 2,000 years later, He decides that this law thing is not working? So He sends His son to free us from His law?  Yet Yeshua is the living word.  What word was John referring to when he wrote John 1:1?  Was he not referring to the so called ‘old testament’?  I would like to suggest to you that we have been duped into believing something that is contrary to the nature of YHVH and to the ‘mission’ and reason for Yeshua.

Yes I do agree though, that the LAW, the plan of YHVH for our lives is very different to the law of sin and death.

So what would you say is the law that we are not under any more? (there are about twelve verses that say, in one way or another, that the ‘law’ (small ‘L’) is not relevant to the Christian.

I have posted the rest of my ‘Free from Law or Free from Sin’ blog that explains this in more detail.  But I would say that the law that we are no longer under is the law of sin and death.  Unfortunately Neil, whether the word law has a small ‘l’ or a large ‘L’ is purely based on the interpretation of the translators.  There is no indication of what it should be in the Greek text apart from context.  So what the translators believed, determined how they interpreted it.  Thankfully one can see, on closer study, through context whether they have correctly interpreted that.

Maybe you could list those 12 (about) verses that say that small ‘L’ law is not relevant to the Christian.  It would be interesting have a look at.

I think the law was given to enable the israelites to see their need to go back to the roots and anchor of their faith – their being children of Abraham, to whom the promises were given, – it was never God’s intention for keeping laws to be the basis of righteuousness.

I love the way you think!  I really really do!  You are right, it was never YHVH’s intention that the keeping of the law would be the basis of righteousness.  The law could never save us, and never will as it does not deal with the sin issue, but Yeshua does, quite decisively too!

I would like to add this.  When did Yisra’el receive the Torah, the instructions of YHVH?  Was it while they were in Egypt or not?  It was while they were in the wilderness AFTER they had left Egypt.  I ask that you do not diminish the value of this picture as it is a picture that is valid today.  The Hebrew word for Egypt is ‘Mitsrayim’.  The ‘yim’ part of the word makes it plural or dual.  I would like to suggest to you that Mitsrayim is speaking of the land of Egypt but also the kingdom of darkness and of sin and bondage.  For Yisra’el to come out of darkness into the light (fire by night and cloud by day) the Passover lamb had to be slaughtered.  For us to come out of darkness into the light (Yeshua) the Passover (Yeshua) had to be slaughtered.

Once the Passover was slaughtered YHVH led Yisra’el to the desert where they could receive the Torah.  The Torah was given so that Yisra’el (and us) would know how to live in YHVH’s kingdom in relation to Him and in relation to each other.  He told them what was good to eat and what was not.  Do we honestly believe that this has changed?  He told us when we needed to rest and to worship Him.  Do we honestly think this has changed?

The Torah throughout the ‘OT’ is shown to be that which is light as opposed to darkness, straight as opposed to crookedness, good as opposed to evil, righteous (straight) as opposed to wicked.  Do we honestly believe that because Yeshua died and rose again, the Torah became something that was bad and not to be kept?

Either then or now. I guess you’re saying that too.

I guess we are very close to saying the same things.

But I’m not sure where the line is between the law that we’re not under and the law that we are under. – personally!

I guess that all depends on what law you believe we are under and what law you believe we are not under.  My purpose in my blog at the moment, is to go through the ‘NT’ and show that where we have been taught that we don’t have to keep the law of YHVH, or the Sabbath, or that we can eat any and all manner of unclean foods, that we can worship on any day we like and all that sort of thing, is wrong, and has been twisted to suit the leaders who first began to propagate such terrible lies, which have been passed down from generation to generation. (Read Jeremiah 16:19-21). Nations in the Word always refers to the goyim (Gentiles). We have inherited lies and the Father is bringing us back into line with Himself.

If we begin to realise that Yeshua came to set us free from sin and restore us to His Father’s commands then the line begins to become quite obvious.  We are free from the law of sin and death so that we are free to obey Yeshua the living Torah.

Again, I would like to thank you for you considered and thoughtful response.

Since I initially wrote this response you added this comment to another blog of mine:

“I have to confess, I find these blogs you write incredibly confusing and I just do not know what you’re on about!”

It is my goal and my purpose to make my blog as easy to follow and understand as possible because if it is confusing then there will be no understanding.  Please could you explain to me how my blog is confusing so that I can relook at it.  I am always open to constructive comments.

May you live a straight and happy life.

Shalom

Bernard (not Sue)

 

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One Response to “Response to Neil on his ‘Free From Law or Free From Sin. Part 3’ comment.”

  1. neil April 10, 2012 at 10:39 #

    Hi Bernard

    I think one thing I find confusing in your teachings is when, in making a point, you try to include (and negate) all the possible arguments being raised by that very point – e.g. in all you statements about lawlessness vs torahlessness and what supposed truths are in fact not truths when you restate them subsituting torah for law. It would be cumbersome to try to quote exactly where you do this but I am sure you know which passages I’m referring to – well, maybe!

    So, preumably, you don’t believe we still have to sacrifice bulls or make incense out of onycha, galbanuim and francincense?

    I’m wondering where you see the cut off point in which parts of the Torah we are not under any more.

    N

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